Jerry and Cristie Johnston interview Texas Super Lawyer W. Mark Lanier

Lanier has won court verdicts totaling between $12 – $13 billion dollars. In October 2012, Mr. Lanier was awarded the coveted Clarence Darrow Award. In 2015, Mark was named the 2015 Trial Lawyer of the Year by The National Trial Lawyers and The Trial Lawyer magazine during the Trial Lawyers Summit in Miami. Pepperdine, St. John’s, and Trinity International Universities have bestowed Honorary Doctorate degrees on Mr. Lanier. Cristie and I sat down with him at his remarkable Lanier Theological Library, which exhibits exquisite, unique architecture and houses a comprehensive collection of 100,000 books, periodicals, magazines, artifacts, and historical documents all designed to aid the serious study of Scripture in Houston and include one of the highest esteemed collections of C.S. Lewis. The Stone Chapel on the grounds of the Lanier Library is a reconstruction of a 500 A.D. church in Tomarza, Cappadocia (Turkey) and was built using photos of the original church ruins taken in 1909 as well as an analysis of the site by a Harvard student published in 1971. Mark extended his legal defense skills in his book, Christianity on Trial: A Lawyer Examines the Christian Faith.

“Let’s talk first about Christianity on Trial. Cristie, I know you had some questions about the book.

Dr. Cristie Johnston: Well, Mark you spend your life in the art of convincing. So if you had 60 seconds or less to convince me the truths about Christianity. How would you approach that?

Lanier: Cristie, the biggest problem I see with a lot of people is they want to prove Christianity in the way you prove science. In science, you can prove in a laboratory.  Mathematics, you can prove on a chalkboard. And those are valid ways to prove science and mathematics, but if I want to prove does Cristie love Jerry; Dr. Johnston love Dr. Johnston? You can’t prove whether someone loves another with science, in scientific methodology. It’s the wrong measure of proof. In courtrooms, we recognize that because we have to prove not only who ran the red light, or did the product cause a heart attack, or did so and so murder so and so, but we have to prove things like, what is the level of pain and suffering. What is the level of mental anguish? Does someone love someone? And you can’t prove those things scientifically. You prove them by what’s called the preponderance of the evidence. What’s more likely than not? And that’s proof. And so when I want to engage someone in whether or not Christianity is true, the first thing I try and do is help them understand that proof is not simply science. There are loads of things. We can’t prove ‘was Napoleon at Waterloo’ by science. We have to use other methods of proof, and that’s where I start with people.”

We certainly captured on film a stunning interview with one of America’s very finest trial attorneys. Are there proofs for the Christian faith? Why are believers not informed and articulate to share these faith facts? Further, what are the specific reasons why nearly 70 million adult Americans have “disaffiliated” from the church? Cristie and I drilled down on this issue and Mark’s answers were thought provoking. We have now filmed with nearly 90 international leaders and our documentary saga continues. We will keep you informed as we move to its release and the invaluable ancillary support resources designed for children, youth, and adults.

Researchers, Drs. Jerry and Cristie Jo Johnston, are Executive Producing a quick-paced film via trans continental, staccato interviews documenting the shocking rise of the non-religious.

Dr. Jerry Johnston and I reflect on November 9th

Dr. Cristie Jo JohnstonTODAY is November 9.  What a special day for me and it’s been that  for thirty-eight years now.  Almost twenty-four hours have passed since America elected Donald Trump as President Elect. Social media has been inundated with people sounding off either “for” or “against.”  News media outlets now reporting demonstrations where fires are being set along with overturned cars in major cites throughout our land. College protesters are burning United States flags, angry over Trump’s victory.  I just put my sweetheart, Jerry Johnston, on an airplane for the kajillionth time since we said, “I do” years ago.   Just prior, Jerry and I grabbed a quick salad at a local, quiet place and I reminded him of TODAY.  “It’s November 9,” I gleefully explained.  In response and at the memory of it, Jerry flashed that darling smile, at me, from across the table.  It was so reminiscent of the one that made my heart flutter for the first time on Sunday night, October 22, 1978.  Daddy invited Jerry Johnston to come over to our home that night for some good food and fellowship.   Jerry was nineteen and wearing a blue suit.  I stood at the kitchen island preparing some snacks.   I glanced over at Jerry sitting at our family’s dinning table.  Our eyes met and Jerry flashed that coy smile at me.  He had me at “Hello!”  I had no clue Jerry and I would be in the same room, sitting at that exact table, only days from when the first smiles were exchanged and my life would forever change.

After the airport run, I arrive home to the cool of the evening in anticipation of a quiet and reflective night decked out in my favorite flannels.  I have digested enough of this “today” in 2016.  It is time to redirect my thoughts toward my “today.”  Jerry has a long flight.  I need to open my laptop and quickly check Flight Aware to track my darling during his overseas flight.  As always, I pray for Jerry’s safety and protection. I turn the television on for updates, but gladly mute it.  The quiet is eerie and I hear the refrigerator running. I glance over at the other matching swivel rocker chair and the manly presence that filled it, earlier today, is gone.   Like my grandchildren always ask me, “O” (short for the German form of Oma), how many sleeps until Papa is home?” It’s only five sleeps until that matching chair rocks again in tandem with mine.   Come home my love.  Jerry’s flight is delayed almost an hour.   Before I close my laptop, I see a Religion News Service commentary titled On Nov.9, we are all Zacchaeus by Randy Hollerith.

I’m a little curious so I linger.   I like the article, and, one line, in particular stands out because it’s my today.  Hollerith writes, “The results of Election Day are not an end; they are the beginning of a new path.”  How apropos because thirty-eight years ago today is when my new path began.   Like Zacchaeus, I needed a “better view of Jesus,” but who would show me the way?  At nineteen, my life had encountered some horrific challenges, and I couldn’t see the forest for the trees.   I finished Cosmetology school in record speed and graduated top of my class.  State boards were completed and only 3 days until my official license would arrive via post.   The landline phone rang.  I ran up the split-level stairs and answered. It was Mrs. Schut extending an invitation for the entire Huf family of 8, along with spouses and significant others, to attend a special church meeting.  “His name is Jerry Johnston and he is a nineteen year old preacher whom I know your parents will enjoy hearing.”  I agreed to pass the message along, but had my mind on other things.   I hear the mail truck delivering the day’s mail.  I dash down the long gravel driveway to see if that one distinct envelope has arrived.  The return address is from the Michigan State Board of Cosmetology, but the size looks different from what the official licenses do.  I rip into the envelope while heading down the long driveway back to the house.    I pause midway and reread the letter thrice.  The tears flow, but not from joy.  My heart is broken.  They claim I failed.  I run into the house and hastily call the president of my school to let him know.  He is shocked.  “My star pupil and how could this happen?”  He calms me down and encourages me to “hold steady” for a few days until he investigates.  I hang up the phone: the same one from where I first heard the name Jerry Johnston, moments earlier.  The waiting is excruciating.  My heart is spiritually tender. Somehow, I feel like accepting Mrs. Schut’s invite to hear this guy, Jerry.  On the next Sunday, my family fills the entire second row and I am within spiting distance away from the preacher, Jerry.  He mounts the pulpit and my body language almost dares him to compel me.  I expect nothing, but then Jerry opens his mouth and the Scripture begins to tenderly flow.  He is not reading from the Bible. It’s all from memory.  I’m riveted and nearly catatonic.  Jerry thunders out one scripture after another and it captures me.  I sit in the middle, my boyfriend to my left and my future sister-in-law to my right.  They want to pass notes so I act as their courier as I sit mesmerized by the Word.  I can’t take my eyes off the preacher.  I’m hooked!  I find things to keep me busy for the next few days, but always find a way to end up back at that church to hear Jerry each night.  Days have passed and I finally get word that an error was made by the State Board and my license would be dated October 17.  It would be arriving within days and I could be ready for work.  Somehow, my heart was shifting and I sensed  “the beginning of a new path.”  Could it be, amidst the teenage chaos encircling my life, I missed that view of Jesus?  That Saturday was a special youth event and I felt I needed to go.  Jerry spoke again that evening and I felt struck.  “God, are You dealing with me?”  I am feeling things I’ve never encountered before.  There is such sensitivity toward the spiritual.  Jerry concludes his message and comes to sit with my sister and me.  We exchange a few words and from that night begin a friendship that quickly matriculates into a relationship.   It’s now Halloween day and, at Jerry’s invitation, I am flying to see him in Kansas City.  The Michigan air is damp and chilly.  I chose my favorite fitted chocolate brown corduroy pantsuit for the trip.  Jerry picks me up at the airport in his blue, Dodge Charger.  The forty-minute drive passes in the blink of an eye.  Just before we pass 95th street, on 69 South, Jerry leans over to gently kiss me.   We arrive at Jerry’s family home.  Jerry’s father is in bed, ill with the flu.  We peek in to say, “Hello.”  Jerry’s mom has prepared a generous and delicious seafood meal and we indulge.  It’s beginning to get dark and the trick-or-treaters ring the doorbell.   Jerry and I walk to Monkey’s Island to be alone and get more acquainted.  That week was filled with treasured memories.  We talked and laughed and ate and prayed and wept and it was time to leave.  Jerry accompanied me back home to Michigan and decided to stay a few days.  I was thrilled.  We stuck together like glue.  It was difficult to separate us.  This love grew fast and deep.  Jerry Johnston and Cristie Jo Huff Johnston Dating November 1978Today is November 9, 1978.   It’s chilly enough for a flannel shirt. Jerry wears a sweater.  He asks me if I want to study some passages from the Bible.  I am all in!  We dig in deep and hours must have passed when I realize Jerry was leading me to the view of Jesus that I needed.  I acknowledge my transgressions and need for a Savior.  Jerry graciously prays with me.  After, I feel like a ton of burdens have been lifted.  Perhaps it is because I realize for the first time, I don’t have to carry them alone.  God, and His Son, Jesus are with me.   As the clock struck midnight, I told Jerry that I feared for my sister, Debra, who lived directly down the street.  I knew, like me, her life was not at all right with God.  But, I knew she was at a place in her life where she was willing to hear.  We rang the doorbell and woke her from a dead sleep.  I shared my journey with her and she tenderly said, “I need Jesus to do the same for me.”

Jerry is great with youth.  As a struggling fourteen year old, he contemplated suicide and ended up at a summer youth camp as a last ditch resort.  It was called Windermere in Roach, Missouri.  Sounds exciting?  Not!  What teenager wanted to spend the week in Roach, Missouri?  It saved his life.  He had a spiritual encounter with God and went home a changed person.  Little did I know that after we wed, God would allow us to speak to thousands of young people in summer youth camps all over the country? Over the years, Jerry was invited to be the camp evangelist at several camps including Southern Baptist Camps.  And, fast forward, God allowed our children to experience several with us.  Our daughter sang at Falls Creek during one of her high school summers.  Jerry was also honored to speak for his good friend, Rick Gage at Go Tell camps.  

I guess I feel like God allowed me to experience my own personal youth camp on November 9, 1978.  So, as the clock strikes midnight tonight and I come to a close with this blogging post, this day holds a very different set of emotions for me.  Jesus is the leader of my world and has been for thirty-eight years.  I will now do what I have done every year since that fateful night.  I will contact my sister, Debra and wish her a “Happy Thirty-Eighth spiritual birthday,” because it is now November 10.    Thank you, Jerry and I love you like crazy!

Jerry Johnston Interviews Youth With A Mission Senior Leader Mark Anderson regarding the Largest Missions Organization in the World

Are all Millennials “nones”? Not at all. Over 30,000 young people are engaged in evangelism throughout the world serving through YWAM in over 180 countries in 1,100 locations. I spent the day with Mark Anderson who has served for decades next to YWAM founder, Loren Cunningham. Multiple thousands of people are coming to Christ in China, Indonesia, and many other countries — the true “news” stories of our day that the media will never report. I consider him one of my most respected friends. Spending time with Anderson, founder of the global pastor/leader movement, I was captivated by stories he shared that sounded like the Acts of Apostles in the 21st century. The Chinese church is raising up 1MM missionaries to take the Gospel worldwide. YWAM features no hierarchical organization chart, which is perhaps one of the reasons for their massive growth and effectiveness. Antidotal to a grim spiritual landscape in North America and Western Europe, YWAM and its army of passionate youth committed to the Great Commission reminds us of what the power of prayer and vision can accomplish.

“The idea that Loren had … and he got it from the Lord, very sovereignly, was that you don’t have to wait until your 30, 35, 40, to engage the Lord and move into some category of influence. God made it clear to him that you can help the young people who are still teenagers, certainly college age, to experience missions and have their lives changed, and encounter the Lord on very deep levels, and make a difference even while they are young. So Youth With A Mission idea is ‘catch them young’ and give them an opportunity to do what we typically think are ‘adult things’ particularly 50 years ago. Nobody thought you could send an 18-year-old to a mission field. You had to be Bible college, Seminary, experience something somewhere, and then be funded, and then you could go. He blew all that up, by God’s direction … now it is normal.”

Why does it seem God is moving in demonstrable ways in nations other than the United States of America? Why do Chinese and Indonesian Christians, who often suffer for their faith, eagerly risk their lives, social status, and much more? One distinction Cristie Jo and I have observed as we travel the globe is their determination to learn “why” they believe “what” they believe. Discipleship has replaced ‘entertainment’ Christianity. As a couple, we will take you on an international journey transcending the shallow reasons for American Christianity’s decline, paradoxically, at the same time it is booming in other nations where Christian leaders are daring to call people to a higher level of commitment and catechism long overdue.

Mark Anderson is the founder and president of He has served in Christian ministry since 1977 in a variety of capacities including senior leadership in


Jerry & Cristie Jo Johnston Interviews Frank Schaeffer on His Journey to Atheism

Dr. Cristie Jo Johnston (@ChristieJoJohn) and I sat down and filmed an interview  for our upcoming documentary with Frank Schaeffer in Boston. He Executive Produced his father’s globally acclaimed film series, “How Then Shall We Live,” and “Whatever Happened to the Human Race?”  Regarding his dad, Michael Hamilton of Christianity Today wrote,”Perhaps no intellectual save C. S. Lewis affected the thinking of evangelicals more profoundly [than Francis Schaeffer]; perhaps no leader of the period save Billy Graham left a deeper stamp on the movement as a whole.” How then did his own son leave the faith of his father? Nearly 70MM adult Americans have left the church. One in three comprise Millennials. Why? The sons and daughters of notable Christian leaders have exited, too. Frank was gracious and kind during our 2 ½ hour absolutely fascinating interview. Cristie and I have a sincere motivation to dig deep with international research and help Christendom understand why this phenomenon is happening, what the future statistical prediction for America is barring divine intervention, and, most importantly, create a digital series representing extensive research to catechize those who believe on three different levels: children, youth, and adult. To this ambitious aim we have now filmed with 87 international distinguished leaders in atheism, agnosticism, secularism, sociologists, and Christian apologists. The digital tools we create will be designed in different languages and stretch around the globe in addition to a documentary that will capture the attention of millions of people. We appreciate your thoughts and prayers. Here is a clip from our recent interview with Frank. Cristie asked:  

Continue reading “Jerry & Cristie Jo Johnston Interviews Frank Schaeffer on His Journey to Atheism”

Jerry Johnston Interviews Peter S. Williams on the Religious Prospect of Britain


Certainly saddened by rise of nones, the pastors and researchers we have interviewed are not entirely disheartened. Though being refined, the church in the UK is experiencing Continue reading “Jerry Johnston Interviews Peter S. Williams on the Religious Prospect of Britain”

Jerry Johnston Researches Reason Rally 2016: David Silverman

Though he comes from Jewish roots, David Silverman has been an atheist for most of his life and is currently the president of the non-profit organization American Atheists. The organization supports atheist rights and the effective removal of any governmental religious expression. I watched Silverman define the term “atheist” for the large crowd at the Reason Rally in June 2016 at our nation’s capital:

“An atheist, ladies and gentlemen, is a person without theism, a person without a belief in god, atheism. A person without a belief in a deity. If you don’t have that belief in a deity, you’re an atheist. It’s not about whether or not you’re absolutely sure there are no gods, and it’s not whether or not you know everything in the universe. It’s about what you know. If you don’t have a belief in a god, you’re an atheist. If you don’t have a belief in a god and you absolutely hate the word “atheist” too bad, you’re still an atheist.”

              Atheism is rising as millennials leave their faith in millions. These “nones” were raised in a biblically illiterate culture surrounded by people who think belief in a god is irrational. With our upcoming documentary and accompanying resources, Cristie Jo and I want to partner with churches and help individuals. Just as Silverman clarified the definition of “atheist,” we must clarify what it means to be a Christian.

Researchers, Drs. Jerry and Cristie Jo Johnston, are Executive Producing a quick-paced film via trans continental, staccato interviews documenting the shocking rise of the non-religious.

Jerry Johnston Researches Reason Rally 2016: Anthony Pinn

The applause that met Anthony Pinn as he greeted the crowd at the Reason Rally was proof of his popularity in secular circles. In June of 2016, I stood with that crowd and listened to Pinn, an American professor of religion and theology from Rice University in Houston, Texas. Pinn is the founder and director of the Center for Engaged Research and Collaborative Learning, and he had something to say about the existence, or lack thereof, of gods.

“For much of the year, we do what we do, the hard work that’s necessary to make this nation more reasonable within the confines of our local communities and regional organizations, but this weekend, this day, we stand strong, family committed to reason and logic. We are prepared to carry our reason without regret, without shame, and with a determination to demand life free of prejudice and discrimination, because we choose to live life based upon reason rather than the words of old books somehow deemed sacred. Theists may try to dismiss us but we will not be ignored. We will not stand by while religious paranoia rules the day, strangling public life. Today marks a new day, a bright and beautiful day when we recognize the public importance of atheism and humanism. We are good without gods.”

              Pinn’s chilling statement “We are good without gods” should spur Christian leaders and pastors as they strive to teach men and women in an increasingly secular culture. Could you counter Anthony Pinn?  Cristie Jo and I earnestly desire to partner with pastors as they seek to fight the rising tide of biblical illiteracy among professing Christians. To facilitate this partnership, we are developing resources that will assist all ages in their quest for biblical literacy.

Jerry Johnston Researches Reason Rally 2016: Larry Decker

My crew and I attended the Reason Rally in Washington DC in June of 2016 to document the largest gathering of atheists in America. We listened to Larry Decker, the Executive Director of the Secular Coalition for America, and long-time government relations professional in the capital. He spent nearly eight years in leadership with the American Red Cross and was the campaign manager for D.C. mayoral candidate, Reta Jo Lewis. Decker said,

“This is a rally that supports religious freedoms, for those who believe, and those who don’t. This is a rally that supports the freedom of, and more importantly, the freedom from, religion. This is a rally to unite all Americans around shared secular values, because secular values are American values. How this Reason Rally is remembered will depend not on what we do here today, but what we do every single day after we go home. I want this Reason Rally to be remembered as a turning point in American history; as the day we started to repeal the religious privilege and exemption laws that the Right has forced on the federal government, on our State houses, and on each of us.”

Sadly, the trend in the North American church is secularization and conformity to the culture. As Christians, our values should come from scripture. Can you defend the truth of the bible and the reasons we have for maintaining our Christian values? Millennials have obviously been left ill-equipped to face such questions and resort to abandoning their faith. Cristie and I are producing resources to equip Christians of all ages to defend the truth of the Bible.

Researchers, Drs. Jerry and Cristie Jo Johnston, are Executive Producing a quick-paced film via trans continental, staccato interviews documenting the shocking rise of the non-religious.

Jerry Johnston Researches Reason Rally 2016: Ian Harris

Satirical comedian Ian Harris has appeared on popular shows, including Jimmy Kimmel Live! and Comedy Central, as well as his own TV special “Critical and Thinking” that is currently on Hulu. He has a skeptical comment for everything from global warming to religion. With his wit and humor, Harris entertained the crowd of the Reason Rally in Washington DC this summer:

              “God creates these two people, Adam and Eve, puts them in this garden. He said, do not eat this fruit. There’s this forbidden tree of knowledge, we can’t have you thinking or learning, so do not eat the fruit from the tree of knowledge. And then a little while goes by and a talking snake comes along and he says, yeah, don’t worry about that guy, he doesn’t know what he’s talking about. Go ahead and eat the fruit. They eat the fruit, God goes, whoa, I told you not to eat the fruit. Now I’m going to have to punish everybody for all eternity by sending them to burn in eternal hellfire, right? And that’s what he does. You’re born, sorry, you go to hell. Why? She ate some fruit, I’m sorry.  You’re born, you go to hell. You’re born, I’m sorry, it’s called justice. That’s how it works. You’re born, you go to hell. Sorry, she ate the fruit. You’re born, you go to – yeah, and then after a few thousand years, or you know, a couple million, depending on whose book you read, God says to himself, I might be being a tad bit irrational. I’m going to have another child, this time a son, and murder him, so that you don’t have to go to hell because this chick ate some fruit. At that point, my daughter gets really angry with me. She goes, Daddy, stop it! Quit being silly. That doesn’t make any sense. Now would you just tell me the real story? And I look at her and I go, you know what, baby girl, that is the appropriate response.”  

              Harris’ version of the Gospel is quite different from the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Are you able to discern the difference? Can you defend your beliefs? Cristie Jo and I are making a documentary and writing many other resources that will teach men and women the truths of the Gospel.


Researchers, Drs. Jerry and Cristie Jo Johnston, are Executive Producing a quick-paced film via trans continental, staccato interviews documenting the shocking rise of the non-religious.

Jerry Johnston Researches Reason Rally 2016: Mark White

At the Reason Rally in Washington, D.C., Mark White, the bass player for the 1990s band the Spin Doctors and an active member of the atheist community, addressed the crowd from the main stage. Mark is a proponent of actively combatting Christianity rather than tolerating it through the New Atheism Movement. After speaking about the hypocrisy of Christians, Mark said:

“So one of the things that really made me upset in the beginning was that being an atheist was a horrible thing. Like, I had – I just chose not to believe in God because there’s no evidence. I realized there was no evidence. I read the Bible. I did everything that was in the Bible that you’re supposed to do, and none of this came out. And so when I became an atheist, I got, like super crazy attacked. All my Christian friends were like, “You’re going straight to hell. What the hell’s wrong with you? You shouldn’t be doing that. God’s gonna strike you down.” And so like, I’m – you know, look, I’m here today, so I thought I’d be struck down before I got here, actually. But here I am. So for all you Christian people, and all you people who are on the fence, the best thing you can do is to question everything.”

Reason and logic pose no threat to the validity of the Christian message. Are you aware of the evidence that supports the conclusion that the Bible is true? Aside from our upcoming documentary, Cristie Jo and I are writing and developing many other digital resources that will equip men and women of all ages with the truth.  

Researchers, Drs. Jerry and Cristie Jo Johnston, are Executive Producing a quick-paced film via trans continental, staccato interviews documenting the shocking rise of the non-religious.